Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 Hello there and welcome to today's proper golfing podcast with me, Joe Cameron. I'm Julian Manna and we're joined today by a very special guest, Stefan Bosson. I think you said we are gingers. I dunno, I dunno what very special you definitely are. I dunno what I am. Anyway, so today we're talking about golf and lower back pain because you might have experienced it yourself, but research suggests that between 30 and 50% of golfers have to stop playing because of lower back pain. So Arm man here knows a lot about backs. He runs a clinic locally here in Warwickshire called Core Clinics, and we know why you called it Core Clinics, but you've treated thousands of people, aren't you over the years and stuff. So yeah, welcome to the podcast today. Thank you very much. So, yeah. So how many, tell us a bit about your facts and figures. How many people have you treated golf, eng golfers, lower back pain? Lots of,
Speaker 1 00:00:50 Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the thing with, with back pain is that everybody's going to get it. So it's really just a, a question of when and golfers within that. Yeah, there's a whole bunch of them, but two reasons really. One, because they love to keep doing what they're doing. And then two, because golf itself will trigger, especially if you're taught in certain ways how to do it, will trigger or accelerate the development of back pain. But it's a beautiful sport. Lots of people like doing it, particularly around here. It's an amazing crowd. People are dedicated to it. I love it. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:01:22 So, so what we're talking about really is helping people play golf for longer Yeah. Without back pain. But the, the, the issue is, forgive me for being so blunt about it, is the way that golf is taught is making these problems worse, isn't it? So you are the per, if you're a person that wants to carry on playing golf and you enjoy playing golf, it's really listen to Stefan today because he'll explain to you how it's affecting your lower back, isn't it? So traditionally, that's where it's loaded in lower back,
Speaker 1 00:01:47 No pressure there then. Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:01:49 You got this mate, don't worry. You got this. I,
Speaker 1 00:01:52 I, I think with golf, like I was saying earlier, one of the beautiful things about it is that it's diagnostic. It will tell you when there is something wrong with somebody. And we just have to one, accept that back pain is a common occurrence. It's a very natural event. The the spine itself is beautiful, beautiful piece of kit, but we all have errors in how we build. Nobody's perfect. There's no such thing as normal. I've never met a normal patient in my life. The idea of normal is nonsense to begin with. So the second thing is that we like the game. We like to do the things that we like, but we don't always do the things around it that we should be doing to support the things that we like. Whether that is resting the way that we eat, the way that we think about ourselves, whether it is the way that we exercise, and we think that it's all about performance and we get driven by things like distance or goal scoring, et cetera.
Speaker 1 00:02:40 And it, it just takes away from what you're actually about, which is enjoying the game itself. And then ultimately, I love golf from a, from an outsider point of view, yes, it does create a lot of patients. That's not why I love it. But, but because clinic, 'cause I see people getting out and socializing and meeting up with their friends and building whole communities around it, and then it drives them into a discipline, whether it's a form discipline and the golf swing itself, or whether it's an exercise discipline. These things are incredibly important both socially, physically, mentally, and, and I, and I think there, there are a few sports out there that do that, and golf is definitely one of them.
Speaker 0 00:03:23 Hmm. So we were talking, weren't we about, you know, like the natural ability of flow, you know, like animals, you watch em and they've got this natural power that we are talking about, proper golf, we're talking about effortless power and we seem to override that somehow, don't we? Why is that? Why is that? That we've got this natural ability that we tend to
Speaker 1 00:03:42 Disease studies
Speaker 0 00:03:43 Human disease?
Speaker 1 00:03:44 Yeah. Because ultimately if you, what it comes down to is that I think for me anyway, humans are a very, very special type of animal because it, it is only, is not only aware of itself, but it is also trying to live and do the things that it does. But in that awareness of ourselves, we are, we are looking at ways that we can improve, do better than we did yesterday. And that's a beautiful trait. That's what got us to make fire. That's what got us to make tools and everything that follows from that all the way up to the internet. And you have this, this wonderful ability to critically assess what we do. But the problem is that what is true for one is not per se true for the other. And we do have a little bit of a tendency to think, I want to be normal.
Speaker 1 00:04:30 I want to fit in, I want to be the same as somebody else. Whether they're somebody we admire or whether's somebody that we aspire to be, we will start to emulate that and copy that. The problem exists there. If you are trying to emulate a person whose body is significantly differently to yours, you, you're just not going to be able to do that whilst remaining in flow. You, you are going against your natural flow and you're overriding it with some kind of conscious model of how you think, you think, you think you should do things. Okay. And, and that's where a lot of these conflicts come in. You know, people with long torsos or with stiff hips, with knees that have seen better days of trying to emulate something that they see on the internet or that they're being told or how to do. And it's just not them, you know, it's
Speaker 0 00:05:20 A bit like trying to teach me to be like mo farra or something, or run an Olympic that you're
Speaker 1 00:05:24 Not made for it. And, and that diversity that we have within the human species is something that we still need to wrap our heads around because there are a lot of different body shapes, body types, body styles, mental styles as well. We appreciate the world differently. Nobody sees the world in the same way. That's one thing we know for sure. Nobody experiences the world in the same way. Yet we try to say this is right and that is wrong. And ultimately what that means is that you're going to have a whole bunch of people that feel wrong doing the thing that is supposedly right. And so a whole bunch of people that feel right are doing the thing that supposedly looks wrong. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:06:00 I was just thinking about this week, you've seen, you know, seen a couple of people this week that they're, they could, if they carry on, you know, hitting the ball that way, they are seriously gonna damage their bodies, aren't they? And
Speaker 2 00:06:11 The sad thing is they've been compared to an elite golfer, so they've put one elite golfer on one side. They've compared this person to the other who's completely different body shape, completely different age group. And they're going, you have to do this.
Speaker 0 00:06:26 Can you just explain what, what they, what that guy was doing? Because we've seen the video earlier on today, haven't we? About what, what he, so what, what, what was he being taught?
Speaker 2 00:06:34 You been taught? He was taught to move his body faster, but he's six foot seven and he really struggled to move and he was trying to get his hips and shoulders turning to the left whilst keeping his head down. So this was putting a tremendous amount of strain on his body. But the sad thing is his club speed was going at the same speed as his body, and that meant he didn't hit the ball very fast. He was putting a lot of effort in getting zero from it.
Speaker 0 00:06:59 So the snaps that you saw, what, what
Speaker 2 00:07:01 Were the, so he was hitting the ball with at full speed for himself about 1 29 was as long his shots. Okay. And within about five shots of freeing him up, helping him understand a little bit more about his natural movement, he was up to one $50. He gained 30 yards within five shots.
Speaker 0 00:07:17 We, we've taken away stuff
Speaker 2 00:07:18 Taking away not adding two, which was an important thing.
Speaker 0 00:07:21 So how, how does that work then from a biomechanical perspective then?
Speaker 1 00:07:25 Well, six was seven. There's so many things that wrap into that because being six three myself, although growing up, you know, 30 years ago, you have this whole sense of you're towering over over people. So immediately you start doing this classic, this classic slumping. Why? Because you don't want to intimidate people. Okay? As soon as I stand up and I stand in full glory in front of somebody is like, you see them cowering away. So you don't wanna do that in social interaction. You make yourself smaller, you change your voice, you change how you appear and feel to other people. That's a whole mirror in your own thing. Yeah. And then, and automatically you start cramping your style and then you, you, you're being told, okay, let's, let's try to fit that into a model of a, a golf swing, let's say for example. But again, are you taking into account the, the, the length of the, the, the, the leg, the, the tools?
Speaker 1 00:08:17 So yeah, exactly. And okay, there, there are many good adaptations within golf round, like golf, swing head, the, the golf club, the, you've got your shaft length, you've got all of those kind of things that are being looked at. But again, I think that's a relatively recent thing in the last 20, 30 years before that. I think that we really have to look at why do we try to fit in? And, and to answer your question with a question, why do we try to fit in? Because once you stop giving up, you start giving up on that and you actually say, okay, no, I'm going to make the gold swings fit around me. Then you start getting into quite an interesting space, I think. But that's true for your workplace, that's true for your car seats. That is true for how you set up your monitor at home. How many years have people had to fight over trying to get a proper desk? Yeah. In, in the office space we had, we had to make legislation in order to force companies to actually give people a, a a, a rising desk or a chair that suits them. That's really the basis to me of this whole nonsense. We try to fit it and we shouldn't even bother trying.
Speaker 0 00:09:21 Yeah, well you were saying about you see the video Tiger Woods on on. So tell us about that, that the video where somebody was trying to, and, and people pick up on things, don't they? They say the think is
Speaker 1 00:09:30 Right? Yeah. And there's, there's this whole idea of, okay, tiger Woods incredible player, you know, Michael Jordan of golf, et cetera, et cetera. Although I think Michael Jordan was a very interesting guy, and it was this, this long, long shot competition where that he was inviting a couple of people to give their best shot and then, and then he, he goes on his knees and outpaces them by, by a country yard. And I think, okay, as a gimmick, great, but what are you actually showing? What are you actually teaching? What are you actually telling people? Yeah. And I think there's something inherently un unhelpful and healthy about it. I'm sure that he perhaps didn't mean it that way, but that's how it comes over. But that's how it comes over. And then, and then people start thinking that that is something to aspire to because a legend, the hero is doing it. How responsible that I can hold tiger for that. That's a different discussion. But I think we need to hold ourselves responsible to the question of what is right for me. Yes. And then you start getting to a much healthier conversation rather than saying, I want to be like, why are we even bothering with that? But what a
Speaker 2 00:10:39 Brilliant, brilliant way. I love that. That, you know, let's, what are you capable of? Yeah. Not well, you don't have to compare yourself to others. And I get really frustrated when people are being compared to elite people. Mm. And the analysis that you see on the television is making it worse because they're slowing everything down. They're putting people in a position rather than in flow. And they're going, you've gotta get like this, one of my, this is causing so many problems.
Speaker 1 00:11:03 One of my favorite athletes in history is Vic football player. And everybody always saw him as a tremendously arrogant chap because he is got this whole confidence about him. But he is actually one of the most beautiful human beings I've ever met. It was this interview where that he, he was being asked by the, by the journalist as a, as a boy growing up, who was, who did you aspire to be like? And he thought about it and he looks into the camera and like, well, me, of course.
Speaker 0 00:11:36 Oh God.
Speaker 1 00:11:37 And the whole thing was people just went off of one and they decided that he was this arrogant so and so, but the point that he was making was pure and simple. How can you aspire to be somebody other than yourself? Of course that is the biggest pile of nonsense that you could. And, and he realized that as a, as a, as a confident young man that was loved by his family and all the rest of it. And he realized all he had to do was be the best of him. And that's exactly what he is done. You know, he's an incredible human being. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:12:04 That's so good, isn't it? You know, like that. So you, you often talk about like your, your best swing, don't you? It's not like somebody else's best swing. It's your, I mean, when do you think, I mean, I I often think best probably not the right word, but, but optimal, you know, your optimal swing, you know, where where can, I mean, we had a, the guys in first Ventura last week, didn't we? And you know, when, when you get to an age, you've got like nerve damage or you know, things that you're playing with. But that doesn't really mean to say that you need to just measure the long shots. So, I mean, sky was a brilliant short game player, wasn't it? That's what you know, where you work at. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:12:34 Well, I, I, I was on the range, I think you videoed me from, from the balcony, and I was sitting some shots at 60%, 50% of what I am capable of doing. And they said, why, why are you doing that? I said, I'm just enjoying my golf swing. I don't need to hit it at a, an extraordinary distance. Join the motion. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:12:53 Well, every round you play like that.
Speaker 0 00:12:55 But you can play, you can do that for an hour. I mean, you were there for o over an hour played
Speaker 2 00:12:59 I had to the balls with no pain, no nothing. Yeah. Because there was no restriction. But I was then joined the movement. I wasn't trying to get into positions, which everybody on the range, you see them all the time setting the club. They're trying to do this and there's no flow, there's no rhythm to the golf swing. And I was just enjoying making a sweeping action for me. And, and the ball went far enough. And I can put speed in if I need to, but why not enjoy the movement? Because there's that feeling. And I, I read something this week that feelings are so much more powerful than thoughts. And if you can feel your golf swing and if you're feeling pain, it's, it's an indicator, isn't it? It's telling you something's not quite right. So, you know, that's where your specialism comes in. Okay. If you can feel it, then there's a problem. Where is it? And it's often not where you're looking. And
Speaker 1 00:13:49 There's a big difference between, between flow and effort. Yes. Yeah. Hundred percent. And so many hundred percent. And so many people get into, unless I'm making an effort, I haven't done my best. Then again, that is something that is so deeply ingrained, socially, socially agree. You, you ask, you ask people who did incredible stuff, you ask incredible athletes. You ask incredible scientists that came up with incredible ideas. They were just playing, it was messing about, none of them actually thought they were doing anything special. It's only afterwards because whilst you're in flow, you're just doing, you're just being, you're just, you're just delivering what your training and your skillset has, has enabled you to do. It's not an effort. But then everybody walks up to you and go, oh, incredible effort, incredible. This, that, and the next thing. So it wasn't to me, but then, but then you don't want to say that because, because that sounds arrogant. So you, you, you're in, you're caught on.
Speaker 0 00:14:46 I get, you know, we, we've got a teenage daughter, you've got, you've got kids.
Speaker 0 00:14:53 I was gonna leave that to you to say you can not, not me, but yeah, you've got more than you have anyway. But you know, I was just, we were just talking about some friends and you know, how how nice their life is and everything, and you know, and, and I said, and I, and I nearly slipped into, or they worked hard for it. And then I thought, no, I'm gonna, I'm gonna challenge myself on that. They were just committed to what they do, wasn't it? And then if you can enjoy what you do and commit to what you do, it doesn't really feel like hard work does it, because like you say, you're just in flow, you enjoying the life, you know, and all
Speaker 1 00:15:21 That. We have this weird idea, I think socially that unless it's taken you efforts, you don't deserve to feel like about
Speaker 0 00:15:28 Because you half killed
Speaker 1 00:15:29 Yourself. Exactly. And, and that, that, that's, that's going to be a, a, an an undertaking for the next generation. I think whether they're going to learn that, that's, that's nonsense in a way, yes, it got us, you know, into things like this and thinking about what, how can we do better? But now that we are getting, and this is where I'm getting excited about in the AI and a GI space where we can actually identify, we now have so many recipes on how to do something, A gold swing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So many gold swing recipes. Okay. So the next stage in this whole process is going to be who are you and what gold swing? What, what is the closest thing to that? Yeah. Whereas in the past we said this is the right goal swing. Yeah. Now we are maybe saying what two, three different right.
Speaker 1 00:16:13 Goal swing for two, three different types. In reality, I think that we are probably going to end up with, let's say a dozen, a dozen models that are better approximations. And then within each of those approximations, we'll refine that further and further until you have your thing, your thing. Whether that is, whether that is your way of working, whether it's your way of playing golf, whether it's your, whatever it is. Running, running is another finding example. Mm. So many people that get forced into a way of running that doesn't even really take into account what's the ankle motion, what, what, what is their flexibility range? What is their natural dominance in terms of muscular firing patterns? Those things all give you information and intel about what's going to be the best way for that person. But then again, it still leaves the question, are you enjoying it? So many people are doing stuff that, yeah, they're very good. And I see that a lot. I look after 500 professional athletes and they, they, they're, they're doing what they are good at, but it's not always what they enjoy doing. And, and then you have to make some decisions about what that means to you. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:17:18 Because if you're not enjoying it, it becomes effort, doesn't it? I know.
Speaker 1 00:17:21 It, it, yeah. It certainly
Speaker 0 00:17:23 Effort is never a good thing, is it? I mean, we'll, we'll move on shortly in terms of what can people do to protect it. But if you treated, you know, 500 professional sports people, you, you know, you, you know, all the time you're seeing people like you say that, I think, you know, you correct me if I'm wrong, but I think with the body, you, when it's in pain, you're either doing too much or not enough. Do you know what I'm saying? You either, I mean, I,
Speaker 1 00:17:42 Too, too much is a, is a, is a funny one. People often say that to me about, you know, over training and, and whilst I'm not gonna say it's impossible, I, I think it's really, really hard. I think, okay, what actually happens with over training is a combination of your heart is not in it and you, and, and you are not training in the way that is right for you. So my specialty is particularly in, in, in track and field and football. And what you see is a lot of different races, a lot of different personality types, a lot of different mental types. And they are being streamlined in academy systems. Yeah. Where that you have to develop at that peak at certain stages where particularly with, with and in football, this has been particularly relevant menstrual cycles where that, you know, the female football, women's football is coming up doing a fantastic job there. You, you have to take these things into account. But the same is true for men as well. You know, we, we also have a menopause. Yes. And we also have aspects that really need to be played with and, and really taken on board intelligently because it changes how you think, how you feel, how you respond to your, your movement cycles, how your body regenerates your rest cycles, et cetera. You've gotta take all of that stuff into account. You account Well,
Speaker 0 00:18:58 They a hundred percent. As we develop these podcasting, we're gonna have, I know, you know, Dr. Jeff Foster Yeah. Who specializes in fence house and you, you know, you, you staff have been, you know, understanding that. So I'm de excited about doing those sort of things. But, so if people wanted to, you know, a very fundamental level, sort of protect themselves and their, and their body. So we need to learn a, a more relaxed swing. But how, what would you say are the, you know, to, you'll do some flexibility exercises or strengthening exercises. What would you say
Speaker 1 00:19:26 If, if you are clear that you want to do something and that you're doing it because you love it, rather than because you're on some kind of masochistic, I have to make an effort and I have to, you know, I have to whatever, then I would say that your primary concerns are physically speaking, are your stability in your hips and your core, core pelvic floor included. You know, a lot of the, the stuff that has been written over the years around core musculature is based, not wrong, but it's a little bit hollow. Biggest thing to understand with core stuff is that you have your pelvic floor, you have your diaphragm, and then you have your muscular wall back and front. That is your core. It's not your abdominals, it's not your six pack. It's not that it's the whole thing. It's a tin can and like a tin can, if you have a dent in any one side of a tin can, it needs to be pin because the whole thing will collapse under the pressure. Yeah. And it's, it's really a, a good core where you have with equal weight, your, your lower pelvic floor, your diaphragm, these are all incredibly powerful muscles. But any torsion, any deviation within that tin can, does cause you to be unable to produce that nice rotational movement. That's why, again, from a diagnostic standpoint, golf is great because it's one of the biggest rotational sports. Yeah, yeah. Yes. You,
Speaker 0 00:20:42 It's fast, it's powerful. Like isn't it weightlifting? Is it something you say is
Speaker 2 00:20:47 Lifting is a very explosive sport. Yeah. And golf is, you know, your, your body's going from Naugh to 60 to naughty just over a second.
Speaker 1 00:20:55 And, and what, what very, you know, who was it that started introducing a lot of that into golf? It was probably only about 15, 20 years ago that they really started looking at, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:21:03 So Tiger Woods was trained by Olympic lifters, right? So he got incredibly strong, but his sport was rotational. So there was a conflict there. He was training the royal muscles basically for his sport. And I've got a picture on the phone, 19 injuries of different parts of his body. But he, you know, he did everything to the extreme, didn't
Speaker 0 00:21:24 They? Yeah. I think you said like the pelvic floor is often something they talked about with, with women, aren't they? Yes. So, you know, I've been, I've been to you bleeding more than men. I've been been to you for my chiropractic physio. I mean, you know, massive testimony to you that 18 months ago I came to see you and oh my god, you know, touch word. It's sort, you know, I, I walk up and run. I can do yoga and my back pain's gone, you know, so massive reflect to you. I can't fly or maybe I come back to you I'll, but the pelvic floor, you know, since, you know, since being a woman of a certain age, I've had to learn about the pelvic floor. So that's really interesting that you're saying, you know, I know men have got a pelvic floor, but it's, it is, it is really neglected, isn't it, in terms of like understanding it being, you know, strengthening it and that, but that, like you say, is gonna affect, it can affect the lower back and then everything can't it?
Speaker 1 00:22:06 You can't, you can't produce basically the That's fascinating. You can't produce the containment and it's that containment that allows you within, within the wall. And is that containment that allows you to transfer power from the bottom up. Yeah. And from the top down, if you don't have that solidity, that containment within there and in a dynamic way, then, then you can't transfer that power down. Whether, whether you're running, whether golf, swinger, whatever it is. And, and you see it, you see the classic, you know, I call it the old mans shuffle where the bum is tucked underneath and the feets are playing out and, and then there's that, that slightly drop waddle that goes with it. The hips of course are gonna go because there's no support, there's no mechanism there. And, and one of the classic, you know, if you look at, if you look at grace youthfulness and, and, and, and, and strength, what do you see glutes to shoulders back that openness of the position. And, and it is that openness of the position that allows you that full rotation, that dynamic responsiveness. And as soon as you start collapsing that inward time,
Speaker 2 00:23:09 Hundred percent
Speaker 1 00:23:09 So reversal, it's almost going back into design embryonic state. And you can't deliver anything in that. And, and it's in those songs
Speaker 2 00:23:17 Book. Absolutely. Part of of the setup is everybody gets that way. Yeah. Round shoulders and then there's no, you've got, they're really restricted. Yeah. I wonder where core came from, as in people think it's a stomach.
Speaker 1 00:23:30 Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:23:32 Its a mistranslation I suppose.
Speaker 1 00:23:33 I, I I guess, you know, it's one of those where that we, we, vanity I guess, you know, you look at, you look at David the statue and you, you look at that body and you see, you know, but it, it is complicated because it is things like the Venus Belt. Mm. If you're familiar with that, you, you have a window for developing that. Children that don't exercise and load bear and and and run or a high impact sport, you have a window up until about early twenties. And if you don't actually develop that, you, you will have a really hard time developing it later in life. That that's for that, that classic, yeah. Hundred percent front. I think with a lot of the, the narratives around core Musculature, there was probably the eighties, I'll blame the eighties. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:24:19 The Spice Girls really. And, and the apps, you know, it became all about the apps. It
Speaker 1 00:24:23 Was all about crunches and all the rest of it. But no weightlifting, you know, you, you go back to ancient Greece, it was, it was stones, it was running, it was jumping, it was throwing all of that stuff. They, they had a much more rounded physical education around it as well. It was essential. A school was called a gymnasium in Paris, in Greece. There was a very, very close association between mind and body man ano the, the, the great motto over the educational system was a healthy mind and healthy body. You can't, you can't produce power up here if you don't have power in there. And so I think we are in a phase now where reeducating that, and I look at the next generation, I look at my children, you know, they're going to the gym, they're doing these things. I love it. It's fantastic.
Speaker 1 00:25:09 Back in the eighties, you try to find a gym, you couldn't find a gym full of the mother. You know, it's, you can't. And now we have them everywhere. We have completely different culture around our physical health, around our mental health, thank goodness. So I do think we're going in the right direction, but it just needs a little bit more focus, a little bit more pulling together and saying, Hey, you know, let's find, be you. Let's figure out what you love. Focus on that. Be dedicated to it. And going back on the point of effort, effort is essential to growth. There is no growth without a little bit of discomfort, but it's just really about understanding why you're doing it. If you're starting to get into an uncomfortable space and you're pushing yourself in there and and causing yourself harm, that's where we need to get a little better. As a, as a, as an individual. That's hard. That's hard. You've gotta trust your, you've gotta trust the people that give you
Speaker 0 00:26:04 Feedback. Yeah. I mean, for me, as you as you know, we've known each other a long time, but yoga's my thing and yoga's taught me so much about, you know, to get the most out of your body. It's not about force. It's about allowing, it's about relaxing into that stretch, you know? True. And then you can feel much more, more flexible. It's not only just about flexibility, but control, control, control. I'm just wondering how, how on earth we summarize this for everybody and how on earth we just point 'em in the right direction to maybe have you got some resources that we can maybe share, you know, about the power floor and all that sort of stuff. Maybe we can come up with 'em as a, you know, if you, if you, if you, if you, if you're just listen to this, we'll put some pictures on Facebook anyway, if you're watching, then great. But, but yeah, I, how would you summarize all that then really for, you know, terms of what, what people can do to maybe protect themselves or learn about their body a bit more in relation to golf? What would
Speaker 1 00:26:48 You say? I, I think that realistically you gotta find out more about who you are, what you are, and accept that. And I don't mean that, accept that and lie down and, you know, just wither away. And with the way we engage with sports today, it's like never before people's play more sports now than they have done in the last hundred years, let's face it. Yeah. Because we have other things to be distracted with, like building, building societies and things like that where you look at core, where you look at pelvic, pelvic floor, whether it is your diet, whether it is your nutrition. Go and find out resources. Go and engage with things that you enjoy, with people that you enjoy engaging it with when it comes to a specific sport. Whether it's running, whether it's tennis, whether it's golf. Start by feeling your way through what feels good and start to differentiate between what is flow and what is hard work.
Speaker 1 00:27:53 Yeah. Yeah. And I think a lot of people don't actually to say, know what flow feels like. And we have made a bit of an error in the nineties, I would say in particular. But from then on where we elevate this thing as being something special. Yeah. It's not, that's a natural state. Yeah. That is how to feel. And you mentioned serotonin, dopamine, and, and, and I would add cortisol in that. Yes. Yeah. As a s hormone where that we need to learn to dance that dance and Yes, life is difficult. It is absolutely. I'm making out that it's, it's all easy, easy, easy. No, you don't build anything that is worthwhile. Whether it's, you know, I try to go to the gym, I love my yoga. I go and see, you know, it's, it's a fantastic set of things to do. We have to develop a better relationship with how we understand what we owe our bodies.
Speaker 1 00:28:46 Yeah. Your body is not you, your body is a vehicle that takes you from conceptional birth, whatever you believe, all the way to death. And that space in between, that's your car. You're at birth, you're given a car, you're given a house. Yeah. You know, and that's, that's the place you can let you, you, you can do modifications, you can paint it a little bit, you can re carpet it. But a lot of the time when you are working in the clinical end that maybe you find that in terms of what you do, I have people that come into my office and they say, Hey, I I, I've got, I've got this, this, this, you know, black mold growing in the, in the corner of, of my, of my house. And it's the, the, the, the, the walls are starting to crumble down. Say, yeah, but stop pissing in the corner.
Speaker 1 00:29:34 And, and they do the, we do these things as, as if we have something to prove with our bodies. Yeah. No, we, we have to care for them. We have to nurture them. We have to understand. But nurturing and caring also means pushing it, it also means reinforcing it and, and challenging it. Exactly. But I think one of the hard things, and, and, and this goes back to the whole psychology thing as well, is we have to learn this idea of gradually loading. Yes. Yes. And then backing back off. Yes. Gradually loading. Because the problem is if you keep loading, loading, loading, loading, loading, eventually you get this thing, you get fail. Yeah. And things start. And if, if you can do that gently, then you can move that curve upward. And that's where strength, beauty, you know, ability, skill comes in. Nobody was born able to write, able to walk.
Speaker 1 00:30:22 All of those things have to be learned. We have windows for that. The older we get, the harder it can be sometimes to learn things, but again, and unlearn and unlearn things. Absolutely. Because we have these things like written in our heads, birds, it's also very clear when you look at the, the science around there, there's, there's not a great deal. You can't unlearn. Yeah, that's right. As long as you allow yourself to. So I think it's a mixture of kindness towards the fact that we learn things that are wrong and we have to accept that sometimes things we believed to be true were maybe true for someone else. Correct. Rather than for me. Absolutely. And then the other thing is just to embrace the fact that you are not your body. Yeah. It is a vehicle. You're not the
Speaker 0 00:31:11 Car.
Speaker 1 00:31:11 You know, when you put diesel in a petrol, it's not gonna go well. Absolutely. And the fact that your mate next door is putting diesel in, doesn't mean to say that you should or that it is a good idea for you to, yeah. So feeling our way through what's good for us, allowing ourselves to adapt, allowing ourselves to embrace a bit of, a bit of change, whether that's with age, whether that's with hormonal change, whether that's with the weather, you know, in the winter I do very little weightlifting. Yeah. December, January I take off. Why? Because I see that as a natural rhythm that I like to link up with. And I like to feel that, or like to understand that rather than override it. For what? To, to have slightly less body fatted maybe. Who cares? I don't, who cares? I'm happily married, you know, I've got nothing to prove in that respect. Yeah. So you just, you you just gotta go with what
Speaker 0 00:32:04 I think we just so over in that instinctive thing, aren't we? Yeah. I, I think as I, I've tried to not use the word getting older now. I'm like getting wiser because like you say, in the winter, I used to force myself to go out for walks, even at night. Well, no, I'm not, I don't really wanna do
Speaker 1 00:32:16 That yet. And then you don't want to do that anymore. But then
Speaker 0 00:32:17 I don't wanna do it and then it becomes such a big job. But when it starts to get lighter and brighter, then I will start to do it natural. But at the moment I just happily, you know, do my yoga every day in the warmth, then that's fine. And then it'll all pick up again. Absolutely. Oh, we can, we can absolutely talk for days and hours and weeks, couldn't we? Thank you, Stefan. You're welcome. So just the, the web addresses core clinics, Stephan Voss on, I just love your name. It's such a great name. Stephan Ser. It's so cool. Thank you for the blood. No, it's just great. Just that again, Stephan Ser just call name sson. Anyway, so you're on LinkedIn and you're on practice of how many people where you got, I mean, you've got, you do all sorts of physiotherapy, chiropractic style, everything basically.
Speaker 1 00:33:00 So what you call an integrated multidisciplinary clinic basically means that rather than having a group of people that you can go and knock on the doors of, we have care managers, care managers then kind of go assess you. You are best to be seen by this person. Because, you know, we realized 10, 15 years ago that it's, it's impossible for somebody on the outside to evaluate themselves in that way. So I'll see people that actually, yeah, they come and see me as a chiropractor or because they, they heard that a friend of theirs was, was being helped. No, actually you are better off to go and get some dry needling. Go and see the sports therapist. Yeah. To get, to get orthotics made because that's the actual issue. And that underpins the real problem. So we deliver that kind of service and it's working out very well. It's, it's, it's just a really, it's
Speaker 0 00:33:52 The right way to do
Speaker 1 00:33:52 It, isn't it? I, I think so, but at least there's a more right way of doing things. I'm sure there's better ways still. We're working
Speaker 0 00:33:57 On that. It's a really beautiful place to go and visit as well in a place called Hater in Warwick. She's a beautiful, even if you, I mean, you know, people come for all over the country and all over the world for coaching with you, don't they? And I'd highly recommend that you do that with step. It's your body, isn't it? It is important, you know, vessel, it's your body vessel, it's your vessel, it's your vessel treat. Make it happen. If you're struggling at our motto this year, you know, we've opened up a year ago and our motto this year, you know, if you don't know what you're doing, find somebody who does, you know, and usually the best it, it is an investment, but it's absolutely flipping worth it. And it, do you know what I mean by cheap buy is what we say, but it is your body. So Stefan, it's been fantastic today. Pleasure, hasn't it? Thank you ever so much. Thank you. Yeah, thank you. It's been brilliant. I you've enjoyed it today. Like I say, if you are watching, great. If you're on audio, brilliant. But we'll be putting some copies on our website and stuff. But, so we'll see you again next time. Thanks for watching. Okay, bye.
