Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 Hi there and welcome to the proper Golfing podcast. How to play golf properly with myself, Joe Cameron and Julia Miller.
Speaker 1 00:00:06 Hi. Hi.
Speaker 0 00:00:14 How you doing? Alright, good. Alright, ready?
Speaker 1 00:00:17 Rolling. It's
Speaker 0 00:00:18 Good enough on it. Same coming up on the show today we're talking about using the natural grip. Forgot to play golf rather than the strong grip we've got coming up at the end of the show who's won the free
Speaker 1 00:00:31 Zoom, zoom lesson
Speaker 0 00:00:33 Coaching lesson with Julia. And I'm gonna have some chat on we about the up and coming up and coming tournament in Sawgrass.
Speaker 1 00:00:40 Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 0 00:00:41 Yeah. Excited about
Speaker 1 00:00:42 What? Very excited and a little bit of controversy, but I, you don't know about that. I'll tell you in a minute.
Speaker 0 00:00:48 I know what your man are great surprises, aren't you? But today we wanna dedicate our podcast today to a good friend and a teacher at the school where our daughter was at Very, very sorrowful mournful day yesterday. Sadly passed away far too young with acute leukemia. So it's a very small school in it. And we all felt very sorrowful yesterday.
Speaker 1 00:01:15 Very, yeah. Very, very, very sad Sunday.
Speaker 0 00:01:17 Yeah. I think, you know, when you look at people that made a mark on your life, he was a head of music at the school and one of my favorite lines from him was something like this. I'm not as good as him at doing it, but he said something like, if you're gonna sing badly, sing loudly. Yeah. I thought that was so good. You know, because so many of us hold back ourselves, don't we? And and the other favorite line is that music was made for people that don't do sport, which was great. Yeah. He was such a really big character, wasn't he? And he leaves such a good legacy on the parents, on the children. We had some super constant, he was so passionate. So we're dedicating that to today.
Speaker 1 00:01:54 Yeah. He is left a big hole, hasn't he? Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:01:55 He's left a big hole. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:01:56 God
Speaker 0 00:01:57 Blesses you. Yeah. So we dedicating that today, aren't we to that? So yeah, very sorrowful day yesterday. So it's been busy at this end as well,
Speaker 1 00:02:10 Hasn't it? It's been a very busy month.
Speaker 0 00:02:12 Really? Yeah. Well longer than that, hasn't it? Yeah. So welcome to our new home. You may notice that we are now in our own indoor golf venue in our hometown of Royal Lemington Spa. Yeah. So we've been busy behind the scenes setting it all up now it doesn't look, it doesn't like that much effort went into it, really. But
Speaker 1 00:02:32 It's scary, isn't it? It's all the, all the things that you're do behind the scenes that make it look quite seamless. But there's been a lot of work going, we've
Speaker 0 00:02:39 Got some funt, we like bookings coming right at the last minute of stuff cuz we only live around the corner purposely. But there's been some fun times, haven't we? Just settling in for the evening. Oh, thank goodness. We've got a book in that's tomorrow. Oh no, it's like now in five minutes. Or people finding us on Google, which is, which has been great fun, hasn't it? So we're now fully settled in, we've got the MOGs, we've got the tea, we've got the coffee. So we've fully settled in that way, but it's been a busy time. So first on the agenda is this podcast sits alongside the video on YouTube about the strong and the natural grip, doesn't it? Yeah, yeah. So over to you, because I learned a lot that the strong grip doesn't actually mean like strong as in strength. It's to do with how it looks and how it,
Speaker 1 00:03:18 It's it's what it does to the golf club. It creates a strong club face. Oh. Which is technically deloft it and, and turning it, if you're right on the golf it turn can often turn the club face to the left. So it can make your shots go very low and very left if you get it really wrong. And to compensate for that, you're gonna have to make a compensation in the golf swing to try and keep the, the golf ball going towards your target and to control club face. So I would say it's a very limiting grip. There's very few, I'm gonna say elite golfers who play with a very strong grip. Matt Fitzpatrick would be one who's fringe to mind and he has to change the way he holds his club for chipping. Oh. So the strong grip for him doesn't work for chipping, which is interesting. So
Speaker 0 00:04:08 Long's what the strong grip means again.
Speaker 1 00:04:09 So a strong grip is when both hands, if you're right hand golfer are turned around to the right. So you can see it probably here on the camera for, for the video. But for the sake of the podcast, both hands are turned around to the right. So on your top it's
Speaker 0 00:04:25 A strong club face though.
Speaker 1 00:04:26 Yeah. It, it's, it's a strong grip that creates a strong club face. Okay. Right. So on your top hand you'd see probably all knuckles and on your bottom hand it would be almost like the palm of your hand would be facing the sky or the ceiling if you're endorsed instead of what we would call more natural.
Speaker 0 00:04:42 Okay. So what we'll do, we'll post some pictures on Facebook page of it, but it's for simplicity, it's a bit like a cricket bat grip, isn't it? So a lot of, a lot of people don't, they move from like cricket to golf and they carry over Yeah, their grip.
Speaker 1 00:04:56 They they do because they've been taught to bat in a certain way. They very much lead with their top hand. So they're, they're left under their right under cricketer to just control the bat. But they, they find it very difficult to take that to a golf club. So that, so cricketers quite commonly hit the golf ball quite a long way. But it does go low. It does go left very often as a right end golfer. So, and that's just because of the way they, they naturally hold a cricket bat and golf club, but they should be changing it
Speaker 0 00:05:32 Really. And that's the interesting thing, isn't it? About what you, what you think is right versus actually what is right. Yeah. You know, you just basically, basically get stuck like in a, in a comfort zone, don't you? You do. So because it feels right. You think it's right, but it's actually not. So that's the, that's the point of, you know, having some golf lessons or listening to things like this is that then you've gotta change, which is not always that easy is it? Because it's a bit like, you know, learning to right. Left-handed if you're right-handed. Sometimes it could be as tricky as that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:06:00 Well the, the other issue that, that people don't realize is how limiting it is. So there's certain shots that a golfer could play with a strong grip and they're very, very good at it, but they can't do, I'm gonna say the slightly more delicate shot. So a lo shop for instance, a high shot going over and landing softly is a difficult shot for a golfer to play with a strong grip. Okay. A fade, a high shot with a little fade is really difficult to do with a, with a strong grip. But if the, if you're looking for distance and you don't mind playing down the left side of the golf course, you're right on the golfer, then you know, you can hit the golf ball a long way with it. When you go to natural rather than neutral, it does feel a lot weaker and they tend to fear away from it because I don't, they know what long distance feels like, but they don't like to reign that in a little bit. But if they realize that potential of what's, what's possible with a more natural grip, then I think their golf games would, would totally transform.
Speaker 0 00:07:03 Okay. So I get that you might be different levels of golf, you might be a beginner or you know, a really low handicapper. But just to reiterate, I think that's like a really important point and it about it limits your flexibility of rain, you know, so if you stick with the script, it might be, it might be working for you for a certain point. Yeah. But it'll be holding you back from the other delicate shots that you might wanna play
Speaker 1 00:07:24 Delicate and, you know, moving the ball in, in, in different ways. So ultimately to, to play the best golf ever possible for you, you'd need to hit the ball nine different ways.
Speaker 0 00:07:38 Nine different ways. Is that like nine different Podcasts then?
Speaker 1 00:07:41 Not really, but say it should be a low straight a medium straight, high straight, A low draw, a medium draw a high draw, a low fade. A medium fade. A high fade. So if you could play all those nine shots, you could play golf tremendously. Well,
Speaker 0 00:07:57 Does really know that? Or is that a new thing?
Speaker 1 00:08:00 I would say it's not new. Does everybody know it? No. Are people capable of doing it if they're taught correctly? Yes, everybody can do it. It's just knowing how to do it.
Speaker 0 00:08:13 I reckon that simplifies it a lot though, doesn't it? If you think that you've gotta just learn nine golf shots. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:08:18 Yeah, it would dear. I mean you're gonna have varying amounts of spin on it. But yeah, if you can play those nine then you can definitely play golf to a great standard.
Speaker 0 00:08:27 So stay tuned. So moving from the strong grip then to a more neutral
Speaker 1 00:08:32 Natural. Natural
Speaker 0 00:08:33 Grip. Natural grip. Yeah. So again, pictures will be on the Facebook page right now and there is a video as we say, that gives you the demonstration on the scene as well. It's quite cool doing videos with the sim, isn't it? It doesn't,
Speaker 1 00:08:44 Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:08:44 Brilliant. You, you don't always do what you're supposed to do, which just bing,
Speaker 1 00:08:48 I, I
Speaker 0 00:08:50 So
Speaker 1 00:08:51 Much I now know through, through a bit of recent research, I now know why no golfer can be permanently consistent and it's because we're hyper mobile. We've got so many moving parts in our body. Yes. Yeah, yeah. To control every single part of the body the same time all the time is impossible.
Speaker 0 00:09:12 Okay. So we cover that on another occasion then. Yeah, definitely we will. You're absolutely right. The thing is about mindset, it's about all golfers want consistency, don't they? We're saying you can't have consistency. What we're saying is you can have consistency of mood that will come to on another occasion as well. Because that, that's the thing isn't it?
Speaker 1 00:09:29 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:09:29 More next time. So the grip that we should be using is
Speaker 1 00:09:33 What we were call a natural grip. So I'm sat in a chair, if I let my hands hang just at the side of the chair and I kind of bring them together, that's gonna be a natural grip for me. So a strong grip where both arms would turn in a, in a kind of a, a clockwise direction and now I'm gonna create a strong grip. Whereas actually a natural grip is a much better way of holding a golf club. So you can even do it sitting in the chair, you can practice your
Speaker 0 00:09:59 Grip. So you could literally, you literally just get your
Speaker 1 00:10:01 Almost like putting your hands together. Oh,
Speaker 0 00:10:03 I'm just thinking, you know, what is that like a I'm rubbish animals A dolphin. Dolphin
Speaker 1 00:10:07 A dolphin thing. No, not really.
Speaker 0 00:10:09 No.
Speaker 1 00:10:10 A seal. She's rubbish animals, I have to say. And you actually do that way. You do it that way. Well done. You never let us down
Speaker 0 00:10:27 So bad, aren't
Speaker 1 00:10:28 I? You're,
Speaker 0 00:10:30 I'm genuinely. Anyway, so you're sitting, you know, we're sitting in chairs house so you can put your hands up, could you like
Speaker 1 00:10:37 The front of you? Just relatively straight and then just separate them and you won't be far up
Speaker 0 00:10:42 Separate them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's a nice
Speaker 1 00:10:45 Simple what natural way. Doing
Speaker 0 00:10:47 It. Natural way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because we are all about not, not pushing and not forcing, aren't we proper golfing? It's all about just relaxing into it, enjoying it and that sort of thing. So, well
Speaker 1 00:10:56 That, that has, that has a relevance, but you also need to do things well. Yes, absolutely. So you can't be sloppy. So I get criticized a little bit for saying, you know, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna do very well with this swing cuz it won't hit it very far. But actually if you do it, if you do them the the fundamentals really well Yeah. And you apply speed where it matters, then it looks
Speaker 0 00:11:17 Effortless. And I think that's why the sim has been absolutely mindblowing, hasn't it really for you? I mean he's been in it I think a bit too much. Really.
Speaker 1 00:11:25 Possibly. Nice. You
Speaker 0 00:11:30 Know I'm saying, I'm thinking that, oh, we've got book him, we've gotta to work. Oh, I've gotta be there half an hour early. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:11:36 Well you do. You need to make sure
Speaker 0 00:11:39 It's what I love about social media and Facebook Yeah. Is that you can you actually know what people are doing because, so I'll say, oh my day, we are here most of the time together anyway. And then, and then I'll see a video on YouTube if you're practicing or on Facebook. Oh, it's
Speaker 1 00:11:52 Only two shots though, Joe, Joe. Don't, takes a minute.
Speaker 0 00:11:54 Whatever. Anyway,
Speaker 1 00:11:55 It's still that I should tell you about. I know,
Speaker 0 00:12:00 Whatever. Anyway, but this is where it's been like vital, hasn't it? This can show you. So you know, we, we are talking about, you know, evolution of the golf swing. The fundamentals are really easy to learn, aren't they? The fundamentals. But if you wanna get really good, that's where there's no shortcuts and you've gotta put in some practice, you know, we see people all the time, don't we, trying to play golf like in a week. Well you know, you can't learn to do the splits in week can you? Or whatever. So
Speaker 1 00:12:25 I've, I've found it fascinating backing up through from my knowledge, you know, video content and then back it up with factual information of what's actually happening when you're hit the gold shots. Yeah. No shots are wasted. Right. Whereas on a range, you've got a whole bucket of balls, you're hitting them aimlessly and you just don't know what you're doing. So you're gonna get really good not knowing what you're doing. You know, practice makes permanent remember, so you might as well do it. Well and I found these sims just environmental,
Speaker 0 00:12:54 It's amazing. They're amazing isn't it? I mean, I know this sounds an obvious thing now that we've done this because of a reason, but there's so many things that we've learned, isn't there? So many, let, let's just talk, you know, as we are moving towards the end of the podcast about how people make change. So there's loads of different, you know, I spent my life in learning. So there's loads of like ways that, you know, models understanding lots of thought prices about how you change. But the, my favorite one is to do with ice. You know, because what we're talking about here is changing from a strong grit to natural grit. A natural, natural grit. We're talking about that. So you've gotta unlock some things. So if you think about ice, how ice changes state, it has to unfreeze to refreeze.
Speaker 1 00:13:35 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:13:36 So if you keep that in your mind, you've gotta unfreeze one grip to then for it to freeze,
Speaker 1 00:13:42 Make it almost liquid malleable. Yeah, absolutely. And then, then freeze it back into that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That state again. Yeah. So lock it in. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:13:50 Yeah. Because your brain wants to go back to doing, your mind wants to go back to doing what it always did. Yeah. But the favorite Henry Ford saying is that if you always do what you always did, you always get what you always got. Okay. So if you are playing these shots and you're limited by your shots, Ben, it's worth trying to change, isn't it? But change always feels weird and it probably feels weird for a lot longer than you want it to.
Speaker 1 00:14:12 What you don't know is what's on the other side of it. Yes, that's right. And when, when you appreciate what you are really capable of doing, then that change becomes, Pete Counts used to say to me, don't get mad, get curious. So if you, if you think of it, it's like, I'm curious now wonder what this is gonna be like. And don't be afraid to fail. So you might hit 10, 15 shots, 50 shots, 500 shots, and, and you only get a few. Right. But at least you know what a few feel like. And then it's repetition. You know, you've got, you've got, you've gotta change that automatic pilot in your brain to your muscles going, this is what we've always done. You've gotta change it, you've gotta challenge it. And then it becomes automatic, then it becomes fun.
Speaker 0 00:14:53 There's also always that other idea as well about not knowing what you're doing then knowing what you're doing. You know, like when you start to learn to drive a car. Yeah. You don't know what you don't know. Yeah. It's a, it's a learning cycle. Most people are familiar with it, but basically you don't know what you don't know. And then somebody tells you what you don't know and then you do know what you don't know. Yes. Which can sometimes be worse cuz like you're going that way. But we're driving. Once you start to practice it, we all know that if you drive a car or ride a bike or do anything, walk in, we doing that from a baby. But if you continue to do that, it becomes like repetition. It becomes automatic. So that's the point is that you've gotta push through these changes, aren't you? So if you keep in mind the ice about, you've gotta unfreeze one habit to put in another one. There was loads of others, but we'll cover those on another podcast. So hope you've enjoyed that little bit of technique information. Yeah. So the pitch will be on the Facebook page and the video will accompany it as well on YouTube. So we've got the exciting weekend coming up. Yes. Is there anything else that we missed by the way, before we move on?
Speaker 1 00:15:52 I'm good. Yeah. I'm just, I'm just really blown away by what we've created here and how it's helping people so fast. Yeah. It it's almost cheating.
Speaker 0 00:16:04 It's cheating. Yeah. It's quite good. We, somebody came in the other day, didn't they? And said, oh, it's a real five star experience. So we work hard to create that and I think having our own place gives us so much opportunity to look after you personally. If you are here or you book a FaceTime lesson, you know, you don't have to come physically here. Yeah, that's right. But it's such an opportunity, you know, to give people a nice coffee or some sweets or whatever on that book. Yeah. We meet some great people. So coming up at the weekend, saw grass. Saw
Speaker 1 00:16:28 Grass. Yeah. Players championship.
Speaker 0 00:16:30 So hang, you're not working the
Speaker 1 00:16:32 Aren't there? Yeah, I'm working No all the time. Not tv. Oh, we got TV in the background. He might be on You
Speaker 0 00:16:38 Did, you know what, if you have a comment, you can't find him. He's sat in the chair, they're watching the golf on the big screen. Just say him. Cause he can see, he can watch everything. So,
Speaker 1 00:16:44 You know, I'm working screen content.
Speaker 0 00:16:48 Anyway. Sawgrass. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:16:49 Sawgrass made famous By which old Joe, who's as a non-golfers.
Speaker 0 00:16:53 I think it's the 17th. It
Speaker 1 00:16:54 Is the 17th I think what's famous about it?
Speaker 0 00:16:57 Something to do with somebody who designed it or
Speaker 1 00:16:59 Something? No, what's what does it look like? The
Speaker 0 00:17:01 17th. Oh, it's got the, has it got the island green? Yay. Yay. See
Speaker 1 00:17:06 Yeah, it's got an island green. I it's, it's a Pete dying design golf course. Apparently. Hope this is true. Yeah. Well I really hope this is true that Pete Dye's wife designed the whole not Pete die. I hope that's true. So apparently
Speaker 0 00:17:22 Every great man
Speaker 1 00:17:23 And all that, all the subs soil was taken out to put over the golf course. It left an island. And I believe his wife was, why didn't just fill it with water, another island green. I hope that's true.
Speaker 0 00:17:33 I wonder if he's actually said that, you know, is International Women's Day coming up? We want an acknowledgement. Come on. We want some acknowledgement that they're,
Speaker 1 00:17:40 It's most, yeah, it's an amazing gold fold that everybody wants to go and have a go at. Yeah, sure. Is that
Speaker 0 00:17:46 On your bucket list?
Speaker 1 00:17:47 No, it would be. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. You want us,
Speaker 0 00:17:54 We do say that time.
Speaker 1 00:17:55 Yeah. There is a bit of controversy in this one.
Speaker 0 00:17:58 What is it?
Speaker 1 00:17:59 So last year's winner isn't play isn't isn't defending his title because it's Cam Smith who's gone to Live,
Speaker 0 00:18:08 Oh. Going
Speaker 1 00:18:09 To live golf. So he can't actually play in it. I watched a little interview from apparently he's gonna go into the crowd and go watch. So if you are there, cam, I mean, you know, you're a phenomenal golfer. I kind of get why you've gone to live. I wish you hadn't gone to live, to be honest. I love
Speaker 0 00:18:27 You are in that camp Aren, you really?
Speaker 1 00:18:29 Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:18:30 Do we wanna actually be more contr controversial now or what? It's just don't, it's everybody's got their own view, aren't they? But
Speaker 1 00:18:36 I, I think if everybody was a bit more honest and said, I've gone to live cause I'm gonna get an awful lot more money. You know, be honest with that. I don't know. People have lost their legacy now, you know, the rights of, of Ian Polter who was, he was one of my idols. You know, the Rider Cup speaks for itself. Oh, do I want to, I don't know. Do I want to take the money and run or do I want to leave a real legacy for, for everybody to another bike? I sit in that camp. Really? Yeah. I, but you know, that's the
Speaker 0 00:19:12 Controversy. That's the controversy then. Yeah. So who's, who's your money on? I love asking you who's your money on? I love asking you this bit because like, you just shut yourself out though, aren't
Speaker 1 00:19:21 You? Yeah, I think the
Speaker 0 00:19:23 Give us your top, top three then.
Speaker 1 00:19:25 Rory.
Speaker 0 00:19:26 Okay. Right, Rory. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 00:19:29 Speak sitting a lot of form. Yeah. At the moment, if you can start knocking some puts in, to be honest, Joe, some of the, the best players are playing the best golf at the moment. So it, it is open, but it's a fabulous golf course, fabulous venue. And you know, may may the best player win really, but doesn't look like there's gonna be any live golfers there. So yeah, I, it's not my thing, you know, I kind of get why they've done it for the money, but you know, I'm not sure I I'm not sure it's got longevity. I think they might get bored of it. The, the Saudis. But we'll see. We'll
Speaker 0 00:20:06 See. Yeah. Oops. Size and downsize to everything I suppose. There's me always in the middle ground. I don't So before we go, yeah, we've gotta announce the randomly chosen winner of the free
Speaker 1 00:20:19 Zoom lesson.
Speaker 0 00:20:21 Yes. Free is Zoom. Where's the envelope? I was pausing
Speaker 1 00:20:23 Because you couldn't remember was
Speaker 0 00:20:25 But it's here. It's absolutely here. So the winner drum roll please is,
Speaker 1 00:20:31 That's it. Oh
Speaker 0 00:20:32 Let's drama. The winner is, I'm gonna give it to Julian to open,
Speaker 1 00:20:36 Have a look.
Speaker 0 00:20:36 So hang on in there. So this is a free zoom
Speaker 1 00:20:40 For a person called Golf Nut who's on YouTube comments on some of the videos. So we've chosen golfer.
Speaker 0 00:20:50 Congratulations. So congratulations golfer.
Speaker 1 00:20:53 You need to get in touch with us. So send us an email
Speaker 0 00:20:56 Too. Send it to me actually joe papa golfing.com. Very easy to remember it that way. So thank you for listening today. Like and share all that sort of jazz will be doing these regularly, hopefully every week. But by all means, if you've got ideas for topics, send us to send 'em to me again, joe@propergolfing.com. But, but yes, have a great golfing week.
Speaker 1 00:21:18 Definitely. And any questions drop
Speaker 0 00:21:22 To Joe, learn to play golf properly. Not at the bottom line. It. Yeah. Yeah. So thanks for listening. Have a great day. All
Speaker 1 00:21:27 The best. Bye. Bye.
